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Archbishop Christodoulos Dies


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#1 Emma1310

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Posted 29 January 2008 - 01:14 AM

http://news.bbc.co.u...ope/7212502.stm

I know his illness has been followed closely in the Greek press and now he is at rest after a long illness.
Now is the time for drinking, now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot.

#2 Emma1310

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Posted 29 January 2008 - 02:37 AM

There's a slightly more sympathetic report in ert for those who are interested:

http://news.ert.gr/en/c/1/30473.asp

wonder if thursday will be a day of mourning?
Now is the time for drinking, now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot.

#3 Assim

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Posted 29 January 2008 - 10:11 AM

It was interesting watching the Greek news last night. They had pictures of the open coffin, with Christodoulos's body in it and people were queuing up and kissing his hands and feet. :rolleyes:

#4 Emma1310

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Posted 29 January 2008 - 01:49 PM

I've heard of that before. Just different culture, I guess. It's like at Easter when the priests bring the erm...I don't know the word..remnants? of the saint out to be kissed.

Mind you, I think Americans have open coffins sometimes, but I daresay they wouldn't actually touch a dead person!

Its probably healthier to confront death like that than hide it away like British people do sometimes.
Now is the time for drinking, now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot.

#5 Wim

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Posted 30 January 2008 - 09:02 PM

Also interesting to read about your interest in the Greek Orthodox religion M.

And about death in a sort of general matter. I think the word you were looking for is relics, being the remnants (bones) of Saints and any other people that were of particular meaning in religions. It comes from the Latin word reliquiae.

:o
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#6 Emma1310

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 12:30 AM

Thank you, Wim. the word escaped me.

the interest really stems from seeing the health of the archbishop documented in the press almost daily. I'm sure our church leaders would not be so revered and the reports intrigued me.

His funeral is tomorrow and I would love to go and see what goes on and take photos but I don't think that would be very respectful. Also, it will be a madhouse there. I heard someone say tonight that the pickpokets have been out in force to rob the old ladies queueing to pay their respects.

:o
Now is the time for drinking, now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot.

#7 Wim

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 04:09 PM

Yes must be quite a spectacle.

And about these pickpockets you mentioned we have a saying in Holland that, I'll try to translate it in English says; One man's dead is another man's bread.

:o
True is that adage: "He who yields to rule by wooden heads, becomes himself a fool."

#8 Tim

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 07:37 PM

The following might not appeal to all - be warned.
There is a book I have "The Death Rituals of Rural Greece" by Loring M Danforth, published by Princeton University Press, Princeton, New Jersey 1982. (Available from Stelios J- PM me if you require his details)
It is a while since I went through it but its title adequately describes the contents. I think it is based upon rituals in Potamia Northern Greece.
There are a series of photographs and explanations towards the rear. It seems that the coffin is open until shortly before it is covered with earth. After a number of years, five years in one case they tell of, the deceased is disinterred and the bones are washed and placed in the village ossuary where they rest for eternity. There are various roles within these rituals, many performed by women.
I recall seeing ossuaries in a number of villages in Crete including Gerakari in the Amari where rest the mortal remains of those executed when the village was destroyed in the war.
My wife is part Irish and she tells of times when a deceased is literally lodged in the corner in an open coffin whilst the wake takes place around him.
In the many parts of the world, just as we don't like to know where our food comes from, we don't like to know much about death. Maybe we are the odd ones!

#9 Fotini

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 12:46 PM

The coffins are almost always open.The thing you noticed ,Emma , about people kissing Christodoylos, it is a general attitudes of Greeks towards dead realtives, friends or even acquaintancies.I 've been in quite enough funerals.Before the coffin goew in the ground , it is open. We throw an ammount of (I don't know if this is the correct word) soil, ground in it. Because ( I suppose happens to many other religions), we belive a man is made out of earth and thiw is where he is going to end up when he dies . When the priest says this exact phrase, we throw soil or whatever.We kiss them because in my opinion we want to say goodbuy and probably farewell.We are probably more accustomed with the idea of death. I Have kissed all my relatives who died. My father too. It never crossed my mind that this action of mine could cause any problems to the state of my health.Even though he had the same problem as Christodoylos and he passed his last weeks in the hospital

#10 Assim

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 01:43 PM

Tim picking up on what you said about the deceased being disinterred. Its common here (Greece) now to dig up the remains after only 3 years. A ceremony is held when this is done, and I have been told can be a little distressing when the body has not fully decayed. I'm not sure if the 3 years has a religious connotation or if the ritual has come out of necessity.

#11 Emma1310

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 11:56 PM

I doubt very much at all can be passed by kissing!

It's just interesting to examine attitudes and burial customs in different cultures. Apparently, cremation used ot be illegal in the UK as recently as 150 years ago. People honestly believed that a cremated person could not be resurrected when judgement day arrived. However, it appears that constraints of land and space may have altered this attitude B)

Similarly, I have heard of Roman Catholic families in the UK, who have held a wake and had the coffins of dead relatives in their house for several days before the funeral.

I can imagine that it is maybe a comforting thing to be able to say goodbye to loved ones in this way. Personally i have never be able to do this, but perhaps that is a reslut of my reluctance to say farewell?
Now is the time for drinking, now the time to beat the earth with unfettered foot.

#12 Fotini

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 06:21 PM

Actually , in some cases we Keep the coffins in our houses the day before the funeral.Thiw iw what we did at my grandparents' funerals. This also took place at the fumeral of one of my friend's granmother.
If the circumstances allow this to take place, we do it. But if the person has died while he was treated at a hospital, it scarcely happens. It depends. People use to pay visits to the house where the coffin is and light a candle in favor of him , or take a bouquet of flowers to put in the coffin.

#13 DaveW.

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 09:06 PM

Emma,
A local doctor in South Wales, Dr.William Price, is considered to be the 'father' of cremation in the UK. An eccentirc gentleman he cremated the body of his 5 month old child, Iesu Grist (Jesus Christ Price) on 18th January 1884. It is considered that the court case that followed and which he won led to the Cremation Act of 1902. Dr Price was trained in Caerphilly and London and started one of the first public surgeries which he held in the Brown Lennox (?)Iron Works, Pontypridd.
He, himself, was cremated in 1893 in Llantrisant,near Pontypridd where there now stands a staute to this memory.

I can remember travelling to South Wales for funerals and having to go into the front 'parlour' to view the deceased person who would be in an open coffin and to pay ones' respects. And before you pass any comment, it was not that long ago!
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#14 Ray

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 07:40 PM

Ieronymos Elected Archbishop
07 Feb 2008 09:15:00 (Last updated: 07 Feb 2008 19:05:07)

By Athina Saloustrou

Bishop Ieronymos of Thebes was elected new Archbishop of Athens and all Greece in the second ballot, sources said. At the first one that concluded shortly after 11.30am, Ieronymos had landed first place garnering 33 votes, Efstathios of Sparta garnered 26 votes, while Anthimos of Thessaloniki and Ignatios of Demetrias trailed with seven votes each. The second voting session commenced shortly afterwards, as the required absolute majority, namely 38 votes, was not achieved. As soon as the new head of the Church of Greece is elected, the chairman of the election process will address the so-called "brief message." He will brief, in other words, the new Prelate on the Holy Synod’s decision.The new Archbishop will then exit the Athens Cathedral and address the priests gathered outside.

The informal candidates, since there are no official candidacies and ballot papers, are four: the Bishops of Sparta, Thebes, Thessaloniki and Demetrias. Should there be no objections, the process will be completed late on Thursday noon. As soon as the new head of the Church of Greece is elected, the chairman of the election process will address the so-called "brief message." He will brief, in other words, the new Prelate on the Holy Synod’s decision.

The new Archbishop will then exit the Athens Cathedral and address the priests gathered outside.
Prior to the elections, it was made certain that at least the two thirds of the acting Bishops were present. A mass was officiated by the youngest Bishop, as the protocol dictates, and then the Bishops started voting.

Congratulations and Wishes

The government through its spokesman expressed best wishes to the newly elected Archbishop Ieronymos. The news about his election satisfied and pleased Phanari. "Appreciation to the personality of Bishop Ieronymos of Thebes is big and old and the expectation for cooperation in handling Orthodox Church’s problems is even bigger", the announcement of Ecumenical Patriarchate stressed. It must be noted that the relations between Thebes Bishop and the Ecumenical Patriarchate have been enhanced by the presence in the Patriarchate of priests who were intellectual offspring of Thebes’ Bishop.


Source ERT Greece.

Ray